#61 good point!
If someone feels unsatisfied with the current 1+0 & premoving, you can also start a 1+1 tournament.
It's fine as it is!
well i mean, my view on "premoving" is that you spent literally zero of "your own" time to come up with it, so i'm fine with losing 0.0 for it.
i don't see what the "troublesome situations" for the "defending side" are:
- you have to play out a completely drawn ending and will lose on time. not getting into the "ethics" of it, that sucks but it does not happen that often in the grand scheme of things
- both players get into the time scramble in a fairly complex game. higher premove skill should be able to offset minor ping differences
- most common: you have a completely losing position and can't do anything to stop your opponent from queening etc. well that sucks too
on the other side, when there is a completely winning position i like it that fast skilled players can queen and convert with 1 second left, specially if they berserked. it's pretty beautiful.
now i'll address kc's reply to me. i'll quote to make it easier to follow:
"In response to #3 so essentially you are saying you need to go out of your way to give up your pieces for a few random checks - which distorts the entire quality of the game - just to run them down by potentially 0.1 second per piece/check ?! But then they come back to zero time used after you threw all your pieces overboard to give those "delay checks" and then they still win on time potentially ?!.
What essentially this is a picture of, is a total bastardisation of bullet chess - where the quality of the game is completely thrown out at the end. So you really think this is correct do you?! Seriously ?!
If the site wants to promote higher quality bullet chess, I am not sure these last move action sequences of random checks are a great "feature" of the current bullet chess model quite frankly - and mostly ineffective anyway against the likes of Whybemad."
it sounds like you never played 0 increment bullet before. you are not some random scrub who is just starting with internet bullet, of course you know that giving up pieces for forcing moves in the last seconds happens pretty much all the time.
so if anything, if someone can take all the random material in offer and still convert to a win, that should bring the game quality up, not down.
0 increment time scrambles will be "bastardized" forever, it's just how it works. the solution for those who don't like that is very simple: play with 1 increment.
The concept that we do not use any time to pre-move and therefore it makes sense to not lose any time is fair enough to me but wrenching myself back to the original question, is it an exploitable flaw, then I think not but have to add the idea I had before that it lends itself to gambling chess where people can make small safe moves that are nothing to do with the position and as light mentioned, this is a skill in itself.
In summary , I do not think its an exploitable flaw but think adding this quantised time loss would also not be unfair. Im a little on both sides even though I was defending one side more than the other :)
I am completely opposed to the idea of a delay with a premove. Bullet chess, and all chess without increment, is a timed game. That means there are 2 separate areas of skill required to play well, obviously actual skillful moves, and then good time management. If I play a 1+0 game, and it takes me 55 seconds to get to a drawn endgame, but it takes my opponent only 20 seconds to make the same amount of moves, then we played equally skilled moves, but I had worse time management, so i deserve the loss I will inevitably get. In my opinion, KC just can't handle the fact that WhyBeMad has better time management than him, and wants to give himself and unfair advantage.
One way to go about making the playingfield less dependent on "outside factors" is to store premoves on the server.
I disagree with .1s for a premove. ICC and
chess.com do this but lichess interface is superior in terms of move transmission. If you cannot handle the speed, do not play bullet. Of course I think bullet is a silly chess variant and I do get flagged a lot by worse and lazy faster and better players but the speed is a lot of the attraction in bullet. It's great that top players like Fins, chessbrahs, and hiimgosu can play 32 premoves or whatever in 2s if they are also fast enough it's part of the fun. i do not understand the point of a penalty, it only punishes fast play, which is the pt in bullet. If both sides have lag compensation up to 2s, barring outstanding lag, it's an even footing (maybe a programmer/developer can tell me if my impression of this is mistaken).
some sort of marker for premoves would be interesting in game review, i agree. to see how the time scrambles were decided when both sides are making mad moves and premoves. or to see how much time was left as you click through the moves [maybe some way the users can manipulate the time graphs?]. i've had a few instances where the clocks did not seem to be correct, but not very recently and it's possible terrible lag was the cause.
no premove time is completely balanced out by the fact that you can only make 1 premove at a time.
look at
chess.com. it takes time (.1s), but you can queue up like 30 in a row. in the end, both systems are about the same.
long story short, its pretty much impossible to lose no time in a premove battle on this site
Hi all
The system as it is at the moment quite frankly does not represent "Equal opportunity" for people on the site. I find it amusing that IM Hambleton and GM Hansen are mentioned as two examples - but they are from the same specific location - the Chessbrahs. And in fact this is extended by "Keithstar" who is not even an IM but resides in the bullet top 10 and in fact was no.1 some time back.. THey are are all *FROM THE SAME LOCATION*
The current system basically is "Rigged" for the haves and have nots - and if you cannot see that, then just look at the evidence.
You may not think this is an issue, but when strong GMs who do not have an amazing setup come to the site - e.g. British GM Mark Hebden who is a bullet chess enthusiast , or let us say for example GM Simon Williams - who might be invited here - he is a new Youtuber - what would happen exactly?! Woud they feel welcomed on bullet chess to be losing on time 99 out of 100 times vs "Keithstar" or "Whybemad" who have often zero skill being demonstrated quite frankly?!
It seems totally at odds with the site philiosopht in fact of being a free site, that in fact you need to have a mega-setup to compete on the bullet time control. Is that really what the intention of the site is - it seems that way right now?!
The 0.1 forced delay still means that *normal* length games - games usually don't go on for mmore than 60 full moves (120 ply), can still be played - and played more skillfully. It would be more about *quality bullet chess* - not *bullshit bullet chess* which the 0 delay is basically creating and rewarding.
Anyway if these points are not apparent - that's fine - I am just pointing them out as I see them rather truthfully and rather bluntly. Try inviting GM Simon Williams and see how he does at bullet chess here - if you want I can try via reddit some time ?!
